eliminating the "double hit"

[Scott Zanni]

Several collegiate volleyball coaches are advocating totally eliminating all "double contacts" in volleyball. In early 2008, the NCAA rules committe is going to consider allowing double contacts to be legal at any time, by any player.

The supporters of this rule change believe it would help the game become more of a major sport in the US as it would remove some arcane rule that no one but volleyball people totally understand. Supporters also believe the rule change would emphasize athleticism over technique, which is more appealing to watch.

The entire story is at this link:

www.avca.org/newsletter/doublehit10-24-07.asp


Curious what people think because if the rule changes I'm guessing high schools would follow at some point (much like the libero serving).

Thoughts?

[g]

No way... emphasizing athleticism over skill, in other words "organized backyard picnic volleyball".

Have the rules changes over the last 10 years made it more popular? Each time they make a rules change, they think it will make it more popular, hasn't happened. I play in a decent number of doubles tournaments, and you can see a marked decrease in the number of people playing now as opposed to 5, 10 years ago. And that's a reflection of the number of adults playing indoors.

In fact, you could argue that trying to emphasize athleticism over skill has actually decreased the population playing the sport since all sports emphasize athleticism. But if a sport has both a degree of skill and athleticism, then there's still a place for players who can't quite jump as high, etc. but have a good skills set.

[Scott Zanni]

g sounds like an older guy...

[steves777]

Coach you are BADdddddddddddd (regarding "g") ..... but probably right.

While i understand competitiveness and the efforts to make some matches more competitive may be well intended ....... i have seen scenarios where teams playing players with lesser skill often are not called nearly as close as the teams who supposedly "know better".

Removing the double hit would do two things ....... ONE ..... it would give less calls for everyone to complain about (me included ... lol) ...... and TWO ...... it would benefit players who have the ability but not the skill ....... (which any player with the ablility can aquire the skill with enough practice).

I am wondering if it would penalize players who perhaps are not the best athletes .... but may simply be better volleyball players ?

In the end, i would most likely support this change in the rules. Many times double hits are not called anyway ...... and sometimes the calls are "nit-picky" about them. I have seen this especially true in a lot of the club tournaments we have been to. Sometimes the calls have been very stringent ... and sometimes not nearly enough so ....... on both sides of the court.

In the end ....... what is left of the rebel in me wins out ...... the fewer the rules ...... the better ...... let the teams play!

[guest]

While we're at it why don't we let the players throw the ball wherever they want to, eliminate the lift. Let's take the skill out of the game all together. Why change the rule double contacts are not called often enough as it is.

[g]

Has anyone watched high level men's college? It's become strictly about athleticism. Even the setters are 6' 3" or taller. After watching one game of a match and admiring how high they jump and how hard they hit, it's boring because the points end typically either on a jump serve ace, missed serve or a kill/error/block on the first swing. There aren't any rallies. Everything is high outside or 1 ball in the middle. It's all about athleticism/power. You see everything in the first game that you'll see the entire match.

[steves777]

to "g"

First of all ....... just having some innocent fun with Coach Zanni at your expense ..... soooo .... hopefully no offense.

I too have watched some high level men's matches and marveled at the athleticism involved. The hits are tremendous and the serves are rockets.

But what makes it so impressive to me is the finness that goes along with all of that power. After all ...... almost every big hit ...... is preceded by a pass and a set.

When you have 3/4 of a second to get to a rocket serve ...... making a good pass requires not only SKILL (and lots of it) but a tremendous display of reflex, agility, and athleticism. Have you REALLY watched closely at the level of timing and coordination involved in the sets at that level? I would not consider it boring by any stretch of the imagination. Isn't that the object of the game? Hit it where the other team can't get it?

Looking at matches at the college level for the ladies ....... the game at the college level is sooooo much faster. As it should be. Eliminating the double hit might make the high school level a bit faster as well. What better preparation for college.

Remember that volleyball is a T E A M sport. Athleticism is essential, but would be rendered useless without the skill and team coordination. The best case in point example in recent times i can give you is the MAgruder / Gaithersburg match.

Both teams have amazing athletes on them. Both teams have excellent skill level players. The difference maker in this matchup was quite simply that Magruder had better skill, which included the ability to work together as a unit. As a team, the Magruder team took a very talented and skilled group of girls to task ....... rendered their athleticism to a very minimal effect ....... and made them look a lot worse than they really are.

Splitting hairs over a "double hit" situation ..... simply would not have effected the outcome of this matchup on this night ......... but the game may have been even more exciting with even more rallies.

[Scott Zanni]

G---I notice you didn't say how well they pass the ball or play defense at the college level...

[sam]

I don't like this idea either of eliminating the double hit. If the point of this change to make the sport more popular, I think it is a lost cause. People watching the sport could care less about whether the setter had a double and disregarding this skill takes away from the actual sport of volleyball. Every sport has its rules.

[whmusser]

Bravo sam! You've said in several short sentences what I'm sure would have taken me half the page!

[g]

Scott Zanni -
Do you think it's a better sport now than it was prior to changing the first contact/double contact rules? That wasn't just a tweak to the rules, it fundamentally changed how the game is played.

I'm not opposed to all rules changes. I'm not ecstatic about the rally scoring, but can live with it. The libero is good. Neither of those changes fundamentally alter how to play the game, they just change how to manage a game. It becomes a different game when you alter how it's played.

If people want to change the rules because the refs aren't consistent in enforcing the rules, that's a referee training issue. There are plenty of refs who do know how to call it correctly. And there will always be incorrect judgement calls in every sport.

If people want to change the rules so the game appeals to more players, it hasn't worked with previous changes. If anything, it turns off the hard core players who have played for years. Like I said before, the number of adults playing doubles is dropping and that's a reflection of the number of adults playing indoors. Being able to set like you have a couple of ping pong paddles on your hands isn't going to make it more appealing.

[g]

Sam's the Man (or I guess, Sam could be a high school girl DS or OPP)!

[Scott Zanni]

Big G---I'll weigh in here.

personal opinion...I like the libero rules for the most part.

I like the defense rules relaxing the double contact. Allows for longer rallies and doesn't fundamentally change the game or many tactics.

I hate the serve receive rules. I think this fundamentally changes the game and allows people with few passing skills to play and de-emphasizes ball control of outside hitters.

The idea of getting volleyball to become the equivalent of a major sport in the US is pretty unrealistic. Volleyball is a sport that is fundamentally flawed for pop culture consumption. For one, it doesn't translate well on TV for most people (much like hockey).

Plus there is an inherent conflict built into the game. Coaches should want their team to pass, set and kill the ball, thus ending the point quickly. That is the "boring" volleyball that Big G talks about. However, the plays that would most interest the general public are the long rallies where no one can put the ball away.

I'm against getting rid of the double contacts, but to play devils advocate, how does it really fundamentally change the game as it currently is setup?

Go watch an international match and you'll almost never see a double contact called.

As for the declining numbers playing doubles G, stop playing in those C level tournaments...

[g]

Scott Zanni - so to be clear here, you hated when they dumbed down the serve receive rules, but it didn't bother you as much when they did it for other aspects of the game. Wasn't serve receive one of your best skills?
I'm sure it's just a coincidence.

[guest]

Eliminating the double hit... sigh... Do people not watch college matches or the Olympics?

By eliminating the double contact, what will become of the setter position? The reason people watch sports, as someone mentioned earlier, is because of the skill involved. Who wants to watch a bunch of mediocre volleyball? Part of the beauty of hitting is watching that perfect set come right into your hands without any spin whatsoever. Eliminating the double contact would just make for an uglier game. Sure, it would make training a setter a heck of a lot easier, but sports aren't supposed to be easy.

While it does help with high school sports (especially in this county where I have noticed a decline in the caliber of setting on top of hitting), it would just be depressing for the collegiate or international games. People on the West Coast would probably be irate with a decision like this, as well as the international volleyball community. Wasn't it bad enough when they allowed double, triple, quadruple contacts on the serve receive?

While we're eliminating calls related to skill and technique (as well as athleticism, since setters are some of the top athletes on their teams)from sports, why don't we eliminate the walk from baseball?